Entry 1087 — P&B, Series . . . Call It 5 « POETICKS

Entry 1087 — P&B, Series . . . Call It 5

P&B is short for “pronouncements and blither.”

At some point in a long Internet discussion with Richard Kostelanetz about the Establishment, I remarked that, “Academic and commercial presses ARE the establishment, or essentially if many time implicitly told what to publish by it. Actually, on reflection (gee, I had that word ready to use then lost it for a full two minutes, except for the “re”), I see that it might make sense to divide the Establishment in two, although they overlap: the academic/commercial establishment that rules contemporary literature, and the one that rules the art of the past. You’ve built your reputation, it seems to me, in the latter (which is where academia is at its best, and often splendid), but not so much in the former–not because of lack of support but because the morons in charge of the former are thirty to fifty years behind what’s going on where most of the best art is coming into existence.

In another discussion, this one at New-Poetry, with a number of participants, Sam Gwynn disagreed with me that “if a poet wants maximal musicality, formal poetry is for him,” with the claim that Whitman achieved maximal musicality in his free verse.

You know, Sam, after really really thinking this over, which is uncharacteristic of me, I concluded that I disagree. It seems to me that if I were a composer, and wanted to achieve maximal musical beauty, I would write for a symphony orchestra, not a quartet–or for a piano, not a flute. Someone will throw Beethoven’s quartets at me, or some glorious melody for a flute, but my point is that a formal poet has all possible auditory devices know to poetry (I think) to work with, a free verser doesn’t. A free verser, or composer for quartet or flute, may still achieve things some subjectively find better than anything else (Hey, I think Thomas Wolfe was wonderfully musical–although that was when I was under 25), but what can he do to achieve what, say, Frost does with rhyme in his Snowy Evening poem? I suppose it’s subjective, although I believe it will not too long from now be objectively provable by comparing what happens in the brain listening to Whitman versus listen to Frost, that nothing in poetry can surpass the music of Frost’s rhymes. I further claim they do what chords do in real music, a rhyme causes you to hear two related notes together in a way nothing else does–and in Frost’s poem, you get THREE together.

Did I show that in my knowlecular poetics discussion of the rhyme?  I can’t recall. . . .

Okay, maybe my gush above is due my bias in favor of Frost, who seems to me to do just about everything word-only poets do better than Whitman, however admirable in so many ways that Whitman may be.

I note now that I’ve quoted myself, that I forgot that, for me, Whitman is a formal poet, albeit a borderline one, due to his use of Psalmic parallelism.

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Entry 1204 — The Exerioddicist, July 1993, P.1 « POETICKS

Entry 1204 — The Exerioddicist, July 1993, P.1

While looking for a poem for use in my Scientific American blog, I came across the following, an issue of Jake Berry’s 4-page The Experioddicist from July 1993 that was entirely devoted to Me:

ExperioddicistPage1

I think it pretty danged fine, and not entirely self-centered, for it has criticism of material by others. I hope that by holding down the control button and clicking the + button, you can get an enlargement you can read. My next three blog entries will have the other three pages–and give me extra time to work on other things.
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Entry 506 — Random Comments « POETICKS

Entry 506 — Random Comments

A few trivial recent comments of mine just to let the curious know I’m still alive.  It looks, though, like I won’t be posting much for a while, for I’ll be out of town each of the next two week-ends.

Back to Wilshberia

Here’s another definition of “Wilshberia.”  I think it probably the most accurate one.  All the kinds of poetry between the formal verse of Wilbur and what I consider the jump-cut poetry of Ashbery taught by more than a few English professors.  So you’d have to survey English departments to pin it down, which I now believe is why I haven’t been able to define it perfectly.  That and the fact that I use it without much thought–in threads where no one else is using much thought.  A really good brief but not perfect definition would be simply the kinds of poetry William Logan discusses in the New Criterion.

Williphobia

Next, something from the essay on Williphobia (psychotic hatred os Shakespeare of Stratford) I’ve been trying to get done (deleted because outside the scope of the essay, but here because I don’t want to forget it):  I hypothesize that mature knowleplexes, healthy or flawed, do not come into being until puberty.  Before that a person’s charactation, or normal level of mental energy, is not high enough to discriminate to any extent among knowlecules (bits of data) arriving, haphazardly organized, accompanied sometimes with contradictions not recognized or dealt with when recognized.  That is, everyone tends to be a Milyoop before puberty–excessively, uncritically, open to the environment.   Children can and do form knowleplexes (full-scale understandings of various unified subjects), but they will be limited to daily (pre-sexual) life, and consist, understandably, mainly of early, simple knowlecules.   No child will form a rigidniplex (near-insanely clung-to irrational understanding) except a rare, highly screwed-up one (such as an autistic child).   Children’s main intellectual flaw is generally ignorance, not irrationality–they haven’t the charactration to be seriously irrational.  (Although they are prey to enthusiplexes.)

A Visit to an Establishment Website

Now from Contemporary Poetry Review, followed by my responses to it, followed by my second thought about my response:

Five Lessons from AWP: Or, Why We Hate Poetry Readings

1)      You should recite your poetry, not read it.

2)      If you can’t recite your poetry, then you can’t remember your poetry. And if you can’t remember your poetry, why would anyone else?

3)      A poetry recital should be a performance.  Most poets read their poems in front of an audience as if they were lecturing to a group of college students. This betrays two illusions. The first is that the poetry audience is the same as a classroom of captives. The second is that the audience must indulge the poet, rather than the poet showing sufficient respect for the audience to entertain it.

4)      A poem should be recited to an audience before it is ever published. This should be a part of the poet’s method of composition and revision. Our modern practice is exactly the reverse: to publish a book of poems and then read them aloud, generally for the first time, to an audience. Is it any wonder that so many poets are so dreadful?

5)      Never be boring. (Many poets are boring – their poetry too.)

Response #1

1. Only a grind remembers poems in any detail.  A lover of poetry’s only important concern is remembering who wrote each good one he encounters, and perhaps enough besides that to help him find it later.

2. If one can sufficiently understand a recited poem one has never encountered before fully to appreciate it,it’s unlikely to be very good.

3. Don’t be boring?  What a revolutionary idea!  Up there with don’t be stupid.

Response #2

Okay, said my smarter self, one good way to appreciate a poem IS to take in its spoken surface so well you can remember it (assuming, as too many do, that all poems are words only). But there are a lot of just-as-good other ways of appreciating a poem, without remembering hardly nothin’ about it.

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Entry 446 — A Question « POETICKS

Entry 446 — A Question

Why do so few innovative poets discuss theirs and other innovative poets’ work?  I think this is the most important reason we continue to be so marginal.

To repeat myself.  Again.

Later Note: if I were to start an Internet discussion group, I would have only one rule: anyone could post a poem to it, but after a single poem has at any time been posted, no one else’s poem could be posted until at least five comments of substance have been made about the posted poem.   I would guess it’d be the least popular such discussion group on the web.

 

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John Ashbery « POETICKS

Archive for the ‘John Ashbery’ Category

Entry 575 — A Half-An-Insight

Saturday, November 26th, 2011

A thought regarding Ashbery’s admirers, which is probably very unfair (but possibly a half-truth): there are two kinds of poetry-lovers: those who want to take a ride in the mind of a poet who will take them to places they wouldn’t otherwise have gotten to, and those who want to get into the mind of a poet that they can take control of—because they can then drive it to places that are safe because they’ve already been to them.  In other words, lovers of poems with destinations like those of Frost, and lovers of anywhere-going poems like (most of) those of Ashbery.

Diary Entry for Friday, 25 November 2011, 1 P.M.: I got another entry posted (I wrote it yesterday but it still counts for today!), and did another exhibition hand-out, which was fun to do.  I needed a nap of about two hours, maybe more, to get the zip to do it, though.  I feel okay now, but haven’t yet started on my book.  I’ve posted to the Internet on the authorship controversy and the Dove anthology, read some more of the Clancy novel I’m reading, and continued the game of Civilization I’m playing where my Greeks are now at war with the Arabs–but America and the Maya are on our side, so we should win.

5 P.M., Mine quest continues.  I did some good clarification on my book, but the going has been painfully slow.  I have a headache.  I’m resisting taking pain pills of any kind.  I keep thinking I’ve gotten everything straight, then at once running into a problem.

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